A broader Spectrum

[beardielover17]

Candice............
out of curiousity, have you ventured into necropsy at all?

ive wanted to but never had the specimens to do so

 

[ladyknite]

I thought you might have breached that road in school by now.

If you're interested, you might find it helpful to start with fetal pigs. You can order those.

 

[beardielover17]

I'm actually getting to the anatomy and all the "gross" stuff now. But since I'm taking online courses they can't really send me a dead animal, have me do a necropsy and grade me on it. I get diagrams instead. I could always go to my old job and grab a couple dead animals from the freezer or any fresh ones and do it on them. My old boss doesn't mind.

 

[ladyknite]

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh honestly...........................go pick up the carcasses.
there is nothing like hands on.

Gross as it sounds, it's hard to imagine the smells, the sights, fluids, organ misplacement at times, until you've actually seen it. Plus it lays way for the future and how you recognize malformities

 

[beardielover17]

are there any specific fluids, tools and such that ill need? i can only assume i would...where could i get the stuff if i do need it?

 

[ladyknite]

Since you'll require no pathology report, and your experiment will only be for your learning experience.....it'll be rather easy. But try to stay neat and concise.

You'll need a microscope, or at least access where you won't contaminate anything. If you want to study fiberous tissue, such lung or kidney or liver tissue, you'll want something as intricate as a scope. But if you want this for just general knowledge, you can do without it.

A few different types of tweezers. pointy, regular and long nosed.
Long sturdy pins such as quilting pins or darning pins.
hemostats
and a scalpel. A good exacto knife will do.
Those large plastic freezer bags
A face mask like for colds
and Vicks Vapor Rub

As you can tell, most of what you need is easy. You'll want a spray bottle, as well as some small bowls (throw aways) and gloves. Never forget the gloves.

 

[beardielover17]

seems like im off to a good start...ive got:

-microscope (goes up to 400x i think)
-blank slides and coverslips
-gloves
-spray bottle
-face masks
-tweezers
-freezerbags
-vicks vapor rub
-bowls

where can i get scalpels and hemostats?

 

[ladyknite]

you should be able to get hemostats in the medical supply store. Know any nurses? They'll be in suture kits for sewing up cuts, and they generally throw them away.

A scalpel is a little harder. Buy a good Hobby Knife, with varying blades. They're precise, and nice to work with. I ordered my scalpels for the vets office.

 

[beardielover17]

many of my friends are nurses so it seems like the hemostats should be easy to come across...ill work on the scalpel/hobby knife

 

[ladyknite]

oops. i meant FROM the vets office.
:

 

[TheVirus]

You can get hemostats at reptile expos. I use them to feed my lizards. Its a good way to introduce them to new foods. They get so used to eating treats off the hemostats that they'll eat whatevers on them without first checking it out. Its also nice if the animal has a high feeding response (monitor) or is timid and your trying to acclimate him to your presence (chameleons).

 

[TheVirus]

Its funny because I've went the other way with husbandry. For instance, if one of my animals falls ill from parasites, I'm more worried as to why the parasite is making it ill. A parasite doesn't want to kill the host, but live off it. If my animal falls ill, I don't blame the parasite, I blame myself for not setting up an environment that supports my animal properly

If my animal got impacted I wouldn't blame mealworms or substrate. If my animal got RI I wouldn't blame humidity. If my animal became dehydrated or had stuck sheds, I wouldn't blame not bathing. If my animal got MBD I wouldn't blame a lite bulb or lack there of. I would blame myself for not setting up an environment that supports my animal.

I'm more in to behaviour and how beardies fulfill needs behaviourally.

 

[zebraflavencs]

*peeks in...*
But Tim ( rebuttal in progress), by adding the pathological aspects to said observations, you can go so much further in your analysis'
Okay... Done for the moment... If I think of anything else, I;ll be back ... and I'm always back
Janie.
*slips out again...*

 

[Red Ink AUS]

Just want to add that in observations you need absolute information to determine "cause and effect", which in itself is an canumdrum as absolute information is rarely possible.

I would just add that more is learned though observation of a specimen than in caresheets or text books as the conditions in which articles/papers are based on differ from keeper to keeper. Unless you re-create the exact same conditions the results will always differ.

 

[crypticdragons]

Just want to add that in observations you need absolute information to determine "cause and effect", which in itself is an canumdrum as absolute information is rarely possible.

I would just add that more is learned though observation of a specimen than in caresheets or text books as the conditions in which articles/papers are based on differ from keeper to keeper. Unless you re-create the exact same conditions the results will always differ.

i completely agree here that was what i was going to say give or take a little.

 

[DragonMom]

:-X

 

[DragonMom]

:-X

 

[beardielover17]

well my old job is at a pet store and my boss would keep the frozen bodies for a little while if someone else found it dead and after that its history...i couldve had dogs and cats recently but doing a necropsy never crossed my mind...if i do one ill be sure to take pictures for everyone

 

[ladyknite]

Its funny because I've went the other way with husbandry.

I definately appreciate that aspect. And also think it's highly important to maintain our standards for our animals..........or should i say further them. It's still scientific, just different than mine. I also know where you're coming from when you say "you would blame yourself for not setting up the environment correctly". Good points there.

Francis....you guys have the opportunity to explore to examine "cause and effect" in nature there. Can you pick out anything in husbandry that has a direct negative impact? For example, the old substrate issue..........which i feel is honestly a personal choice..........yet many want to refer back to nature for that solution. Do you feel that those circumstances can exist in captivity? Or can we only mimic certian aspects, and fall short on others?

 

[crypticdragons]

just a update
they have pretty serious microscopes on ebay for not too bad prices but im not sure if there are brands better than others lol