HELP, I think he's dying!

[LessIsMoreMomma]

My son and I got a bearded dragon for his birthday. It was gifted to us by my father. Although my son is only five, other than it belonging to him I take care of him. I am freaking out right now. I didn't know I cared so much about this thing until right now. I have been struggling to get him to eat for two weeks. He was given to us on October 8th, but my father had him for a week before. My father would just dump crickets inside of the cage and leave them there. When we received him my research showed this wasn't the proper care or the way to feed him so I cleaned and removed all of that and began to feed him a couple times a day. But he would only eat once every other day. I've tried baby crickets, mealworms, and super worms. If I dust anything in his vitamins he won't touch it at all. He went from eating 10 small crickets to nothing. It has been 4 days now and he refuses everything. He just keeps his mouth closed, closest his eyes, and turns his head away. He will even walk away to get away from me trying to give him food. He has not eaten one fruit or vegetable for me since I got him. From what I can see he is a juvenile and not a baby but I am not positive about that. I've noticed him not perching on his rock to be in the heat lamp for 2 days now. I've forced him up there and put him there but he will just go down. He keeps going to the cooler side of the cage and just lays. He's moving super slow and I only see him move maybe once a day. He keeps his eyes closed whereas before when I would open the cage he would look and watch and move around and scurry. Now I open the cage and he doesn't even open his eyes. What the hell do I do? I live in lake county Florida and I cannot find one freaking vet that will see him. Bearded dragons are completely new to me but I absolutely love this little guy and want to help him. I'm also just learning here so any advice and help would just be really really appreciated

 

[Sadie]

My son and I got a bearded dragon for his birthday. It was gifted to us by my father. Although my son is only five, other than it belonging to him I take care of him. I am freaking out right now. I didn't know I cared so much about this thing until right now. I have been struggling to get him to eat for two weeks. He was given to us on October 8th, but my father had him for a week before. My father would just dump crickets inside of the cage and leave them there. When we received him my research showed this wasn't the proper care or the way to feed him so I cleaned and removed all of that and began to feed him a couple times a day. But he would only eat once every other day. I've tried baby crickets, mealworms, and super worms. If I dust anything in his vitamins he won't touch it at all. He went from eating 10 small crickets to nothing. It has been 4 days now and he refuses everything. He just keeps his mouth closed, closest his eyes, and turns his head away. He will even walk away to get away from me trying to give him food. He has not eaten one fruit or vegetable for me since I got him. From what I can see he is a juvenile and not a baby but I am not positive about that. I've noticed him not perching on his rock to be in the heat lamp for 2 days now. I've forced him up there and put him there but he will just go down. He keeps going to the cooler side of the cage and just lays. He's moving super slow and I only see him move maybe once a day. He keeps his eyes closed whereas before when I would open the cage he would look and watch and move around and scurry. Now I open the cage and he doesn't even open his eyes. What the hell do I do? I live in lake county Florida and I cannot find one freaking vet that will see him. Bearded dragons are completely new to me but I absolutely love this little guy and want to help him. I'm also just learning here so any advice and help would just be really really appreciated

Ok basking temps need to be taken w/ a digital probe thermometer- stick ons are inaccurate - get a zoo med from pet Smart or Petco temps need to be 105-110 - next your long tube fixture uvb looks like a T 8 - please get it in the tank or take the screen off it needs to have no cover over the bulb and placed directly above the basking decor 6-8 inches -- he will not eat w/ out these correct- the basking bulb needs to be a bright white bulb no off white or yellowish bulbs -- no coils at all!

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

Ok basking temps need to be taken w/ a digital probe thermometer- stick ons are inaccurate - get a zoo med from pet Smart or Petco temps need to be 105-110 - next your long tube fixture uvb looks like a T 8 - please get it in the tank or take the screen off it needs to have no cover over the bulb and placed directly above the basking decor 6-8 inches -- he will not eat w/ out these correct- the basking bulb needs to be a bright white bulb no off white or yellowish bulbs -- no coils at all!

Hoping you can help me with a couple specific questions with regards to what you told me. How do I adjust the temperature with the heating light? If the uvb bulb needs to be directly above the basking rock then where do I put the heat one? Do I turn just the uvb light off at night or both lights? I've read contradicting info on them need the temps to drop at night.

 

[Sadie]

Hoping you can help me with a couple specific questions with regards to what you told me. How do I adjust the temperature with the heating light? If the uvb bulb needs to be directly above the basking rock then where do I put the heat one? Do I turn just the uvb light off at night or both lights? I've read contradicting info on them need the temps to drop at night.

By a different wattage bulb --- but you MUST have a digital probe thermometer FIRST- do not put a higher bulb in if you do have one -- you do not want to burn him up-- take the probe place on the spot where he would bask wait 10 min or so then get your temp he looks little so try the 105-110 if hes still moving away from it go down to 95-100--- its going to be trial and error w/ the wattage of bulbs--- next your UVB are you using a long tube fixture? I cant see it now --- please post a pic of all the lighting w/ it off underneath the fixtures so I can see what you are using --- please do not dump any more crickets in the tank please clean his tank dont want to be rude and your going to need to get some more basking decor --- what size tank are you using ? Is it a 30 gallon or ? I need to know the size of the tank before I can help you w/ the UVB and placement --- show me the lighting please

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

By a different wattage bulb --- but you MUST have a digital probe thermometer FIRST- do not put a higher bulb in if you do have one -- you do not want to burn him up-- take the probe place on the spot where he would bask wait 10 min or so then get your temp he looks little so try the 105-110 if hes still moving away from it go down to 95-100--- its going to be trial and error w/ the wattage of bulbs--- next your UVB are you using a long tube fixture? I cant see it now --- please post a pic of all the lighting w/ it off underneath the fixtures so I can see what you are using --- please do not dump any more crickets in the tank please clean his tank dont want to be rude and your going to need to get some more basking decor --- what size tank are you using ? Is it a 30 gallon or ? I need to know the size of the tank before I can help you w/ the UVB and placement --- show me the lighting please

You're not being rude at all. You're helping and I am wanting to learn so please tell me it all! I can't fix it if I don't know.

Okay, the uvb is a coil bulb so I'll definitely need to change that.
I am going to go get a digital probe thermometer this evening.
His tank is a little one I know. 16 gallon, 18x18x12. It is temporary for the next couple of month while we build him a permanent one from a dresser to give him a tank that's 36x18x24 which will give him 64 gallons. It's just going to take a couple months to get it done is all.

 

[Sadie]

You're not being rude at all. You're helping and I am wanting to learn so please tell me it all! I can't fix it if I don't know.

Okay, the uvb is a coil bulb so I'll definitely need to change that.
I am going to go get a digital probe thermometer this evening.
His tank is a little one I know. 16 gallon, 18x18x12. It is temporary for the next couple of month while we build him a permanent one from a dresser to give him a tank that's 36x18x24 which will give him 64 gallons. It's just going to take a couple months to get it done is all.

Ok so please get rid of the coil --- ASAP -- you need a 24" fixture for your tank so get this one
Zoo Med https://www.pangeareptile.com/colle...-med-reptisun-t5-hood?variant=26907425734756m this will come w/ a 5.0 bulb please use this till you get your other tank made if it takes longer than 5-6 months the bulb will need to be changed out -- it will go right into the new dresser tank etc -- you want floor space in that new enclosure not height -- when you get the new UVB please post on here so I can help you get it placed in the tank w/ correct distance
the basking light needs to be a bright white NO off white or yellowish color

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

Ok so please get rid of the coil --- ASAP -- you need a 24" fixture for your tank so get this one
Zoo Med https://www.pangeareptile.com/colle...-med-reptisun-t5-hood?variant=26907425734756m this will come w/ a 5.0 bulb please use this till you get your other tank made if it takes longer than 5-6 months the bulb will need to be changed out -- it will go right into the new dresser tank etc -- you want floor space in that new enclosure not height -- when you get the new UVB please post on here so I can help you get it placed in the tank w/ correct distance
the basking light needs to be a bright white NO off white or yellowish color

I ordered the uvb light. Should be here by Friday.
Question about the heat basking light. You said mist be bright white. But the closest thing I'm finding is off white. No bright white. Why does this not work? Also, do I turn off the basking light at night? Or just the uvb light?

 

[Sadie]

I ordered the uvb light. Should be here by Friday.
Question about the heat basking light. You said mist be bright white. But the closest thing I'm finding is off white. No bright white. Why does this not work? Also, do I turn off the basking light at night? Or just the uvb light?

All lights on 12 hrs off 12 hrs--- basking light here is an example
https://www.petsmart.com/reptile/en...nse-basking-spot-light-14809.html?cgid=500202 --- what are you using now for wattage and we dont know the temp yet correct? Did you or have you gotten a digital probe thermometer ? Get you temp w/ that and we will go from there --- I used a 75 watt on my 20 gallon tank --

 

[Sadie]

Also you want temps in the tank at nite 65-75 --a stick on can be used for that temp it gives ambient temp -- look first thing in the morning most tanks will go to room temp of what your house is -- you will need a digital probe hygrometer as well --- Exo Terra sells them place the probe on the back center wall of the tank it will read the whole tank -- optimal humidity is 30-40 or so nothing under 20 or over 70 % - next we can go over diet -- but we must get his UVB and basking temps correct before he will start eating -- and we need to do this ASAP-- what kind of temps are you having outside now?

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

All lights on 12 hrs off 12 hrs--- basking light here is an example
https://www.petsmart.com/reptile/en...nse-basking-spot-light-14809.html?cgid=500202 --- what are you using now for wattage and we dont know the temp yet correct? Did you or have you gotten a digital probe thermometer ? Get you temp w/ that and we will go from there --- I used a 75 watt on my 20 gallon tank --

Yikes. His basking/heat light has been on non stop all month I'll correct that now. The thermometer will be here tomorrow as well as a digital hydra meter to measure the humidity. And the uvb light will be here Friday.
Outside the temps are 72 lows and 90 highs although they are now starting to drop to 85 but probably only for a week (were in Florida).

 

[Sadie]

Yikes. His basking/heat light has been on non stop all month I'll correct that now. The thermometer will be here tomorrow as well as a digital hydra meter to measure the humidity. And the uvb light will be here Friday.
Outside the temps are 72 lows and 90 highs although they are now starting to drop to 85 but probably only for a week (were in Florida).

Ok so in the meantime get him outside in direct sunlight for 15 minutes you can place in him in a plastic tote NO GLASS please -- supervise him -- do not leave him -- you can do this several times / day until your UVB comes --- this is good UVB for him --- when you get your UVB please post back on here and I will help you place it -- in the meantime continue to feed him every day fresh salads ignore the kale thing its a good staple feeder http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html
You can order some BSFL from here www.symtonbsf.com order large ones they are a small larvae DO NOT dust them they are calcium enriched --- use them as salad lures add them to the tops of his salads in front of him hand feed him a couple of them -- they are good for using to hand tame them -- use as many as you want they are a great compliment to the staple feeder --- I would switch over to discoid roaches
https://www.lunaroaches.com/

1 Best Way To Buy Discoid Roaches In Florida Roaches Discoid

Buy Discoid Roaches In Florida, Discoid Roaches are legal in Florida,.are easily digestible roaches blaberus discoidalis

www.readyreptilefeeders.com

Discoid Roaches

Florida Legal Discoid Roaches For Sale

www.joesbugz.com

try these websites -- do not feed anything bigger than the space between his eyes length wise --- dust them 5 x per week ONCE per feeding w/ calcium D3 -- and vitamins w/ beta carotene ONCE per feeding 2 x per week --- lightly coated w / both go by the chart on the websites for size --- when all your basking temps and UVB is correctly in place he should start eating ---- you can use a glass or ceramic bowl similar to this for the salads and BSFL they and the roaches cant get out of https://www.amazon.com/MACGOAL-Rept...uGQB&pd_rd_wg=tLkwE&ref_=pd_gw_ci_mcx_mr_hp_d
Get him on a schedule of feeding times --- w/ the BSFL added in he should eat about 12-15 roaches correctly sized -- and he will probably eat again in the afternoon -- offer a feeding then do not feed him less than 3 hrs before lights out ---- he needs time to start the digestion process --- that UVB his going to help him absorb / synthesize the calcium hes eating ---- dragons like cool and dark to sleep - 65-75 for ambient temps at nite --

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

Ok so in the meantime get him outside in direct sunlight for 15 minutes you can place in him in a plastic tote NO GLASS please -- supervise him -- do not leave him -- you can do this several times / day until your UVB comes --- this is good UVB for him --- when you get your UVB please post back on here and I will help you place it -- in the meantime continue to feed him every day fresh salads ignore the kale thing its a good staple feeder http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html
You can order some BSFL from here www.symtonbsf.com order large ones they are a small larvae DO NOT dust them they are calcium enriched --- use them as salad lures add them to the tops of his salads in front of him hand feed him a couple of them -- they are good for using to hand tame them -- use as many as you want they are a great compliment to the staple feeder --- I would switch over to discoid roaches
https://www.lunaroaches.com/

1 Best Way To Buy Discoid Roaches In Florida Roaches Discoid

Buy Discoid Roaches In Florida, Discoid Roaches are legal in Florida,.are easily digestible roaches blaberus discoidalis

www.readyreptilefeeders.com

Discoid Roaches

Florida Legal Discoid Roaches For Sale

www.joesbugz.com

try these websites -- do not feed anything bigger than the space between his eyes length wise --- dust them 5 x per week ONCE per feeding w/ calcium D3 -- and vitamins w/ beta carotene ONCE per feeding 2 x per week --- lightly coated w / both go by the chart on the websites for size --- when all your basking temps and UVB is correctly in place he should start eating ---- you can use a glass or ceramic bowl similar to this for the salads and BSFL they and the roaches cant get out of https://www.amazon.com/MACGOAL-Rept...uGQB&pd_rd_wg=tLkwE&ref_=pd_gw_ci_mcx_mr_hp_d
Get him on a schedule of feeding times --- w/ the BSFL added in he should eat about 12-15 roaches correctly sized -- and he will probably eat again in the afternoon -- offer a feeding then do not feed him less than 3 hrs before lights out ---- he needs time to start the digestion process --- that UVB his going to help him absorb / synthesize the calcium hes eating ---- dragons like cool and dark to sleep - 65-75 for ambient temps at nite --

Sadie I am so sad right now. Our little dude died today. I am so upset that I was doing all the wrong things... That there is bad information out there and crap pet stores that sell the wrong crap, tell you to do the wrong things, and don't care if these pets die.
I am still wanting to learn and fix everything we did wrong. I want to make an excellent home for one that will thrive. I ordered all those things...the uvb lamp, the digital probe thermometer, the humidity reader, the food dish, ALL this food! I have spent over $400 on all the things in the short 3 weeks I had him. I don't want it all to be in vain. So please, Continue to educate me. Also any articles, blogs, videos you can recommend that will help in our future beardie friend?

 

[Sadie]

Sadie I am so sad right now. Our little dude died today. I am so upset that I was doing all the wrong things... That there is bad information out there and crap pet stores that sell the wrong crap, tell you to do the wrong things, and don't care if these pets die.
I am still wanting to learn and fix everything we did wrong. I want to make an excellent home for one that will thrive. I ordered all those things...the uvb lamp, the digital probe thermometer, the humidity reader, the food dish, ALL this food! I have spent over $400 on all the things in the short 3 weeks I had him. I don't want it all to be in vain. So please, Continue to educate me. Also any articles, blogs, videos you can recommend that will help in our future beardie friend?

I am so sorry-- -- the most important things in the tank are basking temps and the uvb- those things I have gone over w/ you- those things control the overall health and behavior- I want you to sanitize the tank w/ some F10 found on Walmarts website it's spendy or get some rescue or Zoo Med's wipeout- disinfect everything- when your ready to try again post back on here and I will help you get your tank set up- what were you using for substrate? No loose- too much risk for impaction- some textured NON adhesive shelf liner cut to the size of the tank- easy to clean vinegar and water 50 50 solution- there are many things I can help w/ but it makes me very sad to hear he didn't make it

 

[LizardGuru]

I read all this to the very end and ended up in tears. Rest easy little bearded guy

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

I am so sorry-- -- the most important things in the tank are basking temps and the uvb- those things I have gone over w/ you- those things control the overall health and behavior- I want you to sanitize the tank w/ some F10 found on Walmarts website it's spendy or get some rescue or Zoo Med's wipeout- disinfect everything- when your ready to try again post back on here and I will help you get your tank set up- what were you using for substrate? No loose- too much risk for impaction- some textured NON adhesive shelf liner cut to the size of the tank- easy to clean vinegar and water 50 50 solution- there are many things I can help w/ but it makes me very sad to hear he didn't make it

Yes, the lighting and temps WILL be right before we get another one.
What is your knowledge on the water for him. I've read that a water bowl can increase the humidity in the tank (especially a small tank like our starter one) due to evaporation from the lights. That water is not readily available to them in their natural habitat. One beardie expert suggested just spray misting your beardie's face every morning and that would give him sufficient water.
Definitely on disinfecting tank.
We had a felt carpet for him. I like the idea of being able to easily clean it so I'll look for some of that.

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

I read all this to the very end and ended up in tears. Rest easy little bearded guy

The whole situation sucked so bad. Knowing I'm the one to blame out of ignorance but still at fault, it is so sad and infuriating. My poor son spent ALL evening crying. I cried, he cried, it was a very sad evening.

 

[Sadie]

The whole situation sucked so bad. Knowing I'm the one to blame out of ignorance but still at fault, it is so sad and infuriating. My poor son spent ALL evening crying. I cried, he cried, it was a very sad evening.

Please do not blame yourself --- you did what you could for him and you tried --- a lot of people wont even try and take them back to the store -

I know it is very hard on all involved - you get so attached to them and whats saddening is the people that sell and breed these little creatures dont care -- if they did you would see proper husbandry being sold - it is more for profit and not humane reasons - there was a gentlemen on another forum that was in Petco the last few days and walked by the bearded dragons and the tank had all kinds of little beardies in there w/ a tank full of condensation meaning the humidity was up to 95% --- anything over 70 is bad ---- needless to say they were all coming down w/ RI 's -- he told the employee and the guy said he was wrong they were fine and dragons needed that --- obviously he knows nothing about dragons - so w/ that being said I would please not get any advice from Petco or Petsmart employees --

Heres the post

Went to Petco to grab some quick supplies. As I'm walking down the isle where they have the pet reptiles (I always stop to look at them) I stopped dead in my tracks when I saw the enclosure with the baby bearded dragons. The entire front glass was covered in condensate. The humidity stat read 95% with the red warning light on. My head damn near exploded. An employee came walking down the isle asking if I needed help. I said no but those beardies do. I told him he needed to get all those dragons out of that enclosure now and dry it out. He starts arguing with me saying I was wrong and BDs need high humidity. I actually walked over to their own car sheet and showed him how wrong he was. I told him I've been raising these guys for years. The damn reptile carpet was soaked. He kept arguing with me saying I was wrong and the care sheet must have been a misprint. He finally told me I had to leave the store. I was so pissed driving home that as soon as I got home I sent an email to Petco's corporate office. I'm sure nothing will happen but I truly fear what is going to happen to those babies. I hope people stop buying live animals from Petco so it's no longer financially possible for them to keep selling them.
Also as a side note they had a small dish of either mealworms or superworms in the enclosure and the damn things were dead and turning black. How freaking long were those in there.

 

[Sadie]

Yes, the lighting and temps WILL be right before we get another one.
What is your knowledge on the water for him. I've read that a water bowl can increase the humidity in the tank (especially a small tank like our starter one) due to evaporation from the lights. That water is not readily available to them in their natural habitat. One beardie expert suggested just spray misting your beardie's face every morning and that would give him sufficient water.
Definitely on disinfecting tank.
We had a felt carpet for him. I like the idea of being able to easily clean it so I'll look for some of that.

Water dishes are not recommended in the tank unless the dragon actually drinks from it most do not --- and yes it will increase the humidity in the tank -- so unless hes drinking in the tank and your tank has real low humidity in it I would not use one - they just take up floor space - you want a digital probe hygrometer Exo Terra sells them - that probe needs to go on the back center wall of the tank - optimal humidity 30-40% -- you dont want it under 20 and over 70% --- your dragon will most of his hydration from his salads - rinse the greens before serving them - also gut loading the insects as well will help w/ hydration -- watching the poops -- you want formed dark moist stool and white urate -- no dry chalky urate hes dehydrated --

 

[Yvonne G]

I'm so sorry to hear this.

 

[LessIsMoreMomma]

Water dishes are not recommended in the tank unless the dragon actually drinks from it most do not --- and yes it will increase the humidity in the tank -- so unless hes drinking in the tank and your tank has real low humidity in it I would not use one - they just take up floor space - you want a digital probe hygrometer Exo Terra sells them - that probe needs to go on the back center wall of the tank - optimal humidity 30-40% -- you dont want it under 20 and over 70% --- your dragon will most of his hydration from his salads - rinse the greens before serving them - also gut loading the insects as well will help w/ hydration -- watching the poops -- you want formed dark moist stool and white urate -- no dry chalky urate hes dehydrated --

Okay. We're working on getting all the proper things. Can I ask you a couple more questions for your opinion?
Should I bother with this small tank, the 16 gallon one? I liked this one to start with because it has a front door rather top opening. I don't want the beardie to be skiddish about something coming from above, also easier to feed off of tongs and putting in food in general. But even at 16 gallons, most of the space is in height. I also have a 20 gallon tank (30x12x12 in) that I could use before I build. It has a top opening screen. Or should I just wait and build the custom now before getting another one?
What else do I put in the tank? He has the large basking rock/cave that he could climb on and inside of.
Where would you recommend getting our beardie from? I don't want to support pet shops. Especially not after what happened to us.