Substrate discussion (pros/cons)

[DanielE]

Ok first off let me say what I am looking for here. I want a nice calm discussion about the diferent substrate choices. I DO NOT want this to be one of thouse threads that degenerate into an argument and the equivalent of name calling. If you have a different opinion thats ok I would lime to hear it but lets to this in a rational adult manner.
Thank you.

Now that I have that out of the way back to the topic at hand. I understand that some substrates are considered more safe than others and some are highly discouraged altogether (calc sand, wood chips, walnut shells.... etc).
The ones that I am instead in is the ones that have a good reputation of being safe or at least safer with the right care.

These are the ones I have question about. If you coyld give me your experience or understanding on these I would be grateful.
1.) Reptile carpet.
2.) Exo terra sand mat
3.) Tite (textured)
4.) Linoleum
5.) Sanded tile (tile with glued sand simular to exo terra sand mat)
6.) Small gravel (mixed is witg sand or used in decoration)
7.) And lastly SAND. (What types are best- adult dragon consideration)

Also if you do consider one of them "bad" or state that you had a "bad" experience please elaborate so that I can better understand the reasoning.
Again thank you for your time and thoughts.

 

[PatsyB]

Hi Daniel, welcome to the forum. Everyone on the forum is very friendly and helpful we may at times have different opinions but nobody ever attacks anyone for their opinions.

With that said, I currently use reptiles carpet in Dexter's tank and paper towel and shelf liner in Luci's. The reptiles carpet looks nice but can be hard to spot clean because it's absorbant. I only use it for Dexter because she does poop in her tank. I used to have children's play sand in her tank but she didn't really like it much. You also have to sift through the sand to get out any bits and pieces of food.

 

[DanielE]

Thank you. I was not talking about people of this fourm especially when I ask for this to be kept a calm adult discussion. Its just in my research it seems that often time especially when concerning substrate that it happens

 

[lisa127]

I actually use flat sheets of newspaper in my beardies tank. That's also what I use for my leopard geckos. My blue tongued skink gets shredded paper from the paper shredder for burrowing.

 

[DanielE]

I actually use flat sheets of newspaper in my beardies tank. That's also what I use for my leopard geckos. My blue tongued skink gets shredded paper from the paper shredder for burrowing.

I thought paper was a high impaction rist? Also that news paper could dye the belly and feet of the inhabitants. What is your thoughts on this?

 

[Elemental Dragon Lord]

I use play sand and take my dragons out to eat. They still can dig (which all of mine love) and the problem with impaction is drastically cut because they know they come out to eat. It's also easy to clean and a perfect excuse to take them out daily.

 

[diegothediggy]

I use play sand and take my dragons out to eat. They still can dig (which all of mine love) and the problem with impaction is drastically cut because they know they come out to eat. It's also easy to clean and a perfect excuse to take them out daily.

Altho i have sand in part of both my beardies vivs i wudnt use sand for an.all ova substrate. When i first got Diego he came with sand. And i found a few things i didnt like. There was the fact that every.time they walk through the salad dish it.wud.get.full of sand. Also it got in the run of the.door and.made an awful sound. N even if u dnt feed ur beardie in the viv they like to lick amd they will lick the sand and eat it.

 

[DanielE]

I have a big corner water dish that I had in the 40B with my CWD. I could use it as a sand box later on?

 

[lisa127]

I thought paper was a high impaction rist? Also that news paper could dye the belly and feet of the inhabitants. What is your thoughts on this?

I don't see how flat sheets of newspaper could be an impaction risk. My beardie is always walking around tongue flicking the ground. I would think in that situation anything particulate would be though. I have used newspaper for reptiles for almost 20 years and have never noticed anyone being dyed by the ink. I do use old newspapers first though. For example, the sheets in the cages now are from back in March I think. So it's not fresh ink by any means.

That being said, there are certain reptiles I would never use newspaper for. I keep box turtles and they need a natural dirt type substrate to burrow in.

 

[Luvthemanimal]

The topic of topics lol.

First off welcome to our community. Secondly substrates........

With any and all substrates there is benefits and risk...

1. Reptile carpet - pros looks good. Simple to clean and reuse. Low impaction risk. Can feed inside viv. Cons can cause impaction, holds bacteria, can cause beardies toe to get caught.....
2. Sand mat - same as carpet with small difference. Material glued to mat can and will come off. Beardies explore with tounge causes impaction.......
3. Tile - probably the safest of all substrates. Easy to clean, can feed inside viv, pretty well no risk of impaction. Cons beardie can dig, of sharp corners from cutting tile can cut your beardie.... If not cleaned can grow bacteria....
4. Linoleum - same as tile just not as much grip for your beardie
5. Sanded tile - would say pretty safe low impaction risk...... Good for keeping beardies nails trimmed.
6. Gravel - I'd stay away from it... High impaction risk. Serves zero purpose to beardie. Just looks good for you.
7. Sand - easy to clean, beardies can dig. Use washed and sifted children's play sand... If used in whole viv can can be..... Dust = respiratory issues. Can cause impaction, etc.

All and ANY substrate can and while also cause impaction with a DEHYDRATED beardie...... Well HYDRATED beardies tend to have low impaction risks....

Now I myself have used two things not on your list.....

1. Excavator clay
2. Millet seed

Excavator clay is Ok.... Mimics natural habitat very good. Is rock solid when dried....... I however got ride of it because it stained whenever beardies dedicated on it. And when my beardies dug it up it than crumbled into sand like pieces. So i chose to remove it.

Now I use millet seed..... And I love it.... Easy to clean. Promotes digging. Looks fantastic for our pleasure. And best part....... It's 100% DIGESTABLE........ just line bottom of tank with paper towel 2 layers.... This is to absorb water from poop/pee than inch or two of millet seed...... Change out paper towels every couple months and scoop out poop etc....... My beardies love it.


Just remember it's not what we put in the tanks that matter...... It's how we take care of out beardies..... Lighting food temps etc......

Cheers

 

[Luvthemanimal]

Forgot to mention if you use millet seed.... Change the seed every 4-6 months.... Depending on your spot cleaning etc.

 

[DanielE]

I don't see how flat sheets of newspaper could be an impaction risk. My beardie is always walking around tongue flicking the ground. I would think in that situation anything particulate would be though. I have used newspaper for reptiles for almost 20 years and have never noticed anyone being dyed by the ink. I do use old newspapers first though. For example, the sheets in the cages now are from back in March I think. So it's not fresh ink by any means.

That being said, there are certain reptiles I would never use newspaper for. I keep box turtles and they need a natural dirt type substrate to burrow in.

Ok cool. As for the news paper thats just what I had read somewhere.
But thats why I started a thread here. So that I can get things straight and learn about it.

 

[DanielE]

The topic of topics lol.

First off welcome to our community. Secondly substrates........

With any and all substrates there is benefits and risk...

1. Reptile carpet - pros looks good. Simple to clean and reuse. Low impaction risk. Can feed inside viv. Cons can cause impaction, holds bacteria, can cause beardies toe to get caught.....
2. Sand mat - same as carpet with small difference. Material glued to mat can and will come off. Beardies explore with tounge causes impaction.......
3. Tile - probably the safest of all substrates. Easy to clean, can feed inside viv, pretty well no risk of impaction. Cons beardie can dig, of sharp corners from cutting tile can cut your beardie.... If not cleaned can grow bacteria....
4. Linoleum - same as tile just not as much grip for your beardie
5. Sanded tile - would say pretty safe low impaction risk...... Good for keeping beardies nails trimmed.
6. Gravel - I'd stay away from it... High impaction risk. Serves zero purpose to beardie. Just looks good for you.
7. Sand - easy to clean, beardies can dig. Use washed and sifted children's play sand... If used in whole viv can can be..... Dust = respiratory issues. Can cause impaction, etc.

All and ANY substrate can and while also cause impaction with a DEHYDRATED beardie...... Well HYDRATED beardies tend to have low impaction risks....

Now I myself have used two things not on your list.....

1. Excavator clay
2. Millet seed

Excavator clay is Ok.... Mimics natural habitat very good. Is rock solid when dried....... I however got ride of it because it stained whenever beardies dedicated on it. And when my beardies dug it up it than crumbled into sand like pieces. So i chose to remove it.

Now I use millet seed..... And I love it.... Easy to clean. Promotes digging. Looks fantastic for our pleasure. And best part....... It's 100% DIGESTABLE........ just line bottom of tank with paper towel 2 layers.... This is to absorb water from poop/pee than inch or two of millet seed...... Change out paper towels every couple months and scoop out poop etc....... My beardies love it.


Just remember it's not what we put in the tanks that matter...... It's how we take care of out beardies..... Lighting food temps etc......

Cheers

Awesome info thanks a lot. I had not heard of the millet seed before. Ill have to look at it.

 

[Luvthemanimal]

Awesome info thanks a lot. I had not heard of the millet seed before. Ill have to look at it.

Just glad your learning before you get into the addiction........ This folks is the right way to do it...... People should fallow in your footsteps.

Any other questions ask.... We all are here to help.

 

[DanielE]

So anyone else have any input?
I currently thinking of useing reptile carpet for the baby dragon when I get him to start with. But ive still not decided o. What ill do when he/she gets bigger.

One more question though. Should I offer a sand bowl for digging to the baby dragon or is that just for adults?

 

[PatsyB]

Wait with sand until they are at least 15" long. Repti carpet for a baby is fine if you can clean up messes right when they happen and poop doesn't have time to settle into it. Babies poop a lot! Sometimes if the poop hardens and you go to pick it up and the urate breaks apart, it's a pain the but to clean up. I found with my little one, paper towel works the best because I can just remove the sheet he pooped on and replace it with another.

 

[jarich]

No one mentioned bioactive soil yet. Always an option, though it takes a little more work to set up. It looks great, smells great and gives your dragon the most options as far as microhabitat use

 

[Canicke]

So Jarich - tell us about bioactives soils ?

 

[jarich]

Dont mind if I do!

A bioactive soil is one in which you create the right conditions for beneficial bacterial and invertebrate life to thrive within the substrate, that sustain and cycle the wastes of the animal in the enclosure and create a microhabitat for more normal behaviour and health. In simpler terms, its a healthy soil that functions sort of like the water in a fish tank, where it is able to clean itself through natural means and allows for more natural behaviours. It takes a bit of time to set up, with a drainage layer, soil layer with a good mix of humus and various sized particles, and top layer of moss or leaf litter, as well as the addition of things like earthworms, isopods, and springtails. However, once you do, it is a long lasting, healthy, self sustaining substrate that looks great, smells great and recreates a more natural environment for your dragon.

 

[DanielE]

Interesting do you have a link to sone good articles or another thread on the fourm? Id like to do sone additional reading on this.